On Epinions...

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jeannietonyfan said:

subspace said:

That's true. I'll retract my previous statement ("And he's never been a terribly romantic guy"). Still though, in this case it could be said that it was more of a crisis situation than a romantic situation... after all Dr. Bellows *was* involved and it *did* involve his career. It was romantic when he said that but it was also in a time of crisis. But - little difference - we both agree it would have been more touching and better if the writers hadn't tried to add that bit of humor there.

Yes, exactly, but it's still a great scene regardless. I love when Dr. Bellows says to Tony, "All things considered, and I mean ALL things, it has been a pleasure working with you"... it's so moving, and for me it has the subtext that the cast had and the pleasure they had working together, and them knowing that this would probably be the last show they would film... maybe I'm reading into it for more than what's there, but that's the feeling I get when I watch it.

Yes, great scene, very touching. Dr. Bellows in the 'ALL' things meant 'even with Jeannie', but I agree about Hayden Rorke probably also meaning it had been a pleasure to work with Barbara Eden and Larry Hagman and Bill Daily and Sidney Sheldon.

[jeannietonyfan]

lYpr=subspace board=general thread=1170804688 post=1170990256]

jeannietonyfan said:

Yes, exactly, but it's still a great scene regardless. I love when Dr. Bellows says to Tony, "All things considered, and I mean ALL things, it has been a pleasure working with you"... it's so moving, and for me it has the subtext that the cast had and the pleasure they had working together, and them knowing that this would probably be the last show they would film... maybe I'm reading into it for more than what's there, but that's the feeling I get when I watch it.

Yes, great scene, very touching. Dr. Bellows in the 'ALL' things meant 'even with Jeannie', but I agree about Hayden Rorke probably also meaning it had been a pleasure to work with Barbara Eden and Larry Hagman and Bill Daily and Sidney Sheldon.[/quote]
Yeah, exactly. And then the "ALL things" also meaning that all the things that made him think he was going absolutely insane, and constantly trying to get an explanation from Tony... and even with all that, he was still glad to work with him.

[Subspace]

jeannietonyfan said:

Yeah, exactly. And then the "ALL things" also meaning that all the things that made him think he was going absolutely insane, and constantly trying to get an explanation from Tony... and even with all that, he was still glad to work with him.

Yep - that's exactly why that scene was so touching.

[jeannietonyfan]

subspace said:

jeannietonyfan said:

Yeah, exactly. And then the "ALL things" also meaning that all the things that made him think he was going absolutely insane, and constantly trying to get an explanation from Tony... and even with all that, he was still glad to work with him.

Yep - that's exactly why that scene was so touching.

Yeah, I can't say enough about that scene... the flashbacks are cute too, and I like how they kind of pay tribute to Barton MacLane by showing a clip of him as General Peterson.

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jeannietonyfan said:

subspace said:

Yep - that's exactly why that scene was so touching.

Yeah, I can't say enough about that scene... the flashbacks are cute too, and I like how they kind of pay tribute to Barton MacLane by showing a clip of him as General Peterson.

Yeah. I thought the clips chosen for that flashback montage were also quite suitable. (Unlike the clips chosen for Tony's flashback narrative to Jeannie in There Goes the Best Genie I Ever Had.) The tribute was nice too - I always thought Martin Peterson was the best General in the series, and it is too bad that he died during the show which necessitated his replacement by Schaeffer...

[Subspace]

Oh, interesting tidbit sort of relevant to the thread's original topic...

William ('Bill') Asher, producer and director of Bewitched (1964 - 1972) and husband of Bewitched star Elizabeth Montgomery from 1963 - 1973 (i.e. basically during the run of the show, plus one year before the show started and one year after the show ended), also was the director of I Dream of Jeannie - 15 Years Later (1985). That may have been part of the reason IDOJ - 15 Years Later wasn't as good as it might have been... (he might have been approaching it from a Bewitched angle!) - but at least he and the rest of the 15 Years Later crew still did a better job than the people who did the I Still Dream of Jeannie movie.

[jeannietonyfan]

subspace said:

Oh, interesting tidbit sort of relevant to the thread's original topic...

William ('Bill') Asher, producer and director of Bewitched (1964 - 1972) and husband of Bewitched star Elizabeth Montgomery from 1963 - 1973 (i.e. basically during the run of the show, plus one year before the show started and one year after the show ended), also was the director of I Dream of Jeannie - 15 Years Later (1985). That may have been part of the reason IDOJ - 15 Years Later wasn't as good as it might have been... (he might have been approaching it from a Bewitched angle!) - but at least he and the rest of the 15 Years Later crew still did a better job than the people who did the I Still Dream of Jeannie movie.

Yes, I knew about that. I haven't had a chance to see IDOJ 15 Years Later... does it have a kind of Bewitched vibe to it?

[Subspace]

jeannietonyfan said:

Yes, I knew about that. I haven't had a chance to see IDOJ 15 Years Later... does it have a kind of Bewitched vibe to it?

It definitely did, and I did not like that. Many have speculated that Bill Asher thought subconsciously while directing IDOJ - 15 Years Later that he was really doing a remake of Bewitched. Like Patterson, I liked the movie the first few times I watched it... then the more I paid attention to it, the more I realized it was just... wrong. The music was wrong, the blink was wrong, the freaking costumes were wrong. The ending I never liked, and the plot was pretty cheesy and looked like it could have come right out of a Bewitched episode, but even with all that said I still liked it better than I Still Dream of Jeannie (1991). Says a lot about how utterly bad ISDoJ was...

[jeannietonyfan]

subspace said:

jeannietonyfan said:

Yes, I knew about that. I haven't had a chance to see IDOJ 15 Years Later... does it have a kind of Bewitched vibe to it?

It definitely did, and I did not like that. Many have speculated that Bill Asher thought subconsciously while directing IDOJ - 15 Years Later that he was really doing a remake of Bewitched. Like Patterson, I liked the movie the first few times I watched it... then the more I paid attention to it, the more I realized it was just... wrong. The music was wrong, the blink was wrong, the freaking costumes were wrong. The ending I never liked, and the plot was pretty cheesy and looked like it could have come right out of a Bewitched episode, but even with all that said I still liked it better than I Still Dream of Jeannie (1991). Says a lot about how utterly bad ISDoJ was...

Oh, that's too bad! I think it was a mistake to get Bill Asher for it because if he had been directing Bewitched all those years (which after all is a fantasy sitcom) than I guess he was bound to add the Bewitched touches, even if it wasn't intentional.

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jeannietonyfan said:

Oh, that's too bad! I think it was a mistake to get Bill Asher for it because if he had been directing Bewitched all those years (which after all is a fantasy sitcom) than I guess he was bound to add the Bewitched touches, even if it wasn't intentional.

Yup. There is speculation that Bill did that on purpose but I don't think so. Elizabeth was the one who had the problem with IDOJ, Bill never had (as much of) a problem. Bill went so far once as to say that had he still been married to Elizabeth in 1984/1985, he wouldn't have directed IDOJ - 15 Years Later since Elizabeth'd never have let him do it.

I think that it was just that he already had the Bewitched mindset after 8 years of that show (and planning for an anticipated 9th year that only didn't happen because Elizabeth didn't want to do a 9th season). He was so used to it that he added these touches to IDOJ - 15 Years Later without being consciously aware of what he was doing.

Perhaps they shouldn't have gotten Bill for 15 Years Later, but I think he at least did a better job than his counterpart in I Still Dream of Jeannie. (The characterization etc. was all off in ISDoJ, too. And the other stuff was even worse.)

[jeannietonyfan]

subspace said:

Yup. There is speculation that Bill did that on purpose but I don't think so. Elizabeth was the one who had the problem with IDOJ, Bill never had (as much of) a problem. Bill went so far once as to say that had he still been married to Elizabeth in 1984/1985, he wouldn't have directed IDOJ - 15 Years Later since Elizabeth'd never have let him do it.

Yes, I remember hearing him say that... I think it was the E! True Hollywood Story on IDOJ. I don't know why Elizabeth had such a problem... after all Bewitched was certainly at the time the bigger hit, so she didn't have much to worry about.

[Subspace]

jeannietonyfan said:

subspace said:

Yes, I remember hearing him say that... I think it was the E! True Hollywood Story on IDOJ. I don't know why Elizabeth had such a problem... after all Bewitched was certainly at the time the bigger hit, so she didn't have much to worry about.

Yeah, I agree. Especially because the network was behind Bewitched like 1000% at the time, even more than Elizabeth herself was. In the end it was Elizabeth who decided to put an end to Bewitched, the network had already renewed Bewitched for yet another season. And by that time the Bewitched ratings had already sunk to low levels - significantly lower, I believe, than even the low IDOJ Season 5 ratings (the IDOJ Season 5 ratings were due in part to a crappy time slot... Bewitched Season 8 did not have that hindrance to my knowledge). And as Erin Murphy said, IDOJ probably did not steal too many Bewitched fans, either - IDOJ fans in the '60's were probably people who didn't care much for the Bewitched premise anyway. (The converse is also true.) So clearly Elizabeth's show was never threatened in the least by IDOJ.

(I wish IDOJ's network had been like that! If they had kept renewing IDOJ, I can't see Barbara quitting!)

Elizabeth was apparently against IDOJ and specifically Barbara (her [Elizabeth's] obvious counterpart in IDOJ) because she felt that IDOJ was a 'cheap rip-off' of her show [Bewitched]. I think that's part of the reason why so many Bewitched fans even this day still defame IDOJ by calling it a Bewitched rip-off or wannabe. It's really unfortunate that Elizabeth never bothered to dig beneath the surface similarities to find out how different the two shows really were.

[jeannietonyfan]

subspace said:

jeannietonyfan said:

subspace said:

Yes, I remember hearing him say that... I think it was the E! True Hollywood Story on IDOJ. I don't know why Elizabeth had such a problem... after all Bewitched was certainly at the time the bigger hit, so she didn't have much to worry about.

Yeah, I agree. Especially because the network was behind Bewitched like 1000% at the time, even more than Elizabeth herself was. In the end it was Elizabeth who decided to put an end to Bewitched, the network had already renewed Bewitched for yet another season. And by that time the Bewitched ratings had already sunk to low levels - significantly lower, I believe, than even the low IDOJ Season 5 ratings (the IDOJ Season 5 ratings were due in part to a crappy time slot... Bewitched Season 8 did not have that hindrance to my knowledge). And as Erin Murphy said, IDOJ probably did not steal too many Bewitched fans, either - IDOJ fans in the '60's were probably people who didn't care much for the Bewitched premise anyway. (The converse is also true.) So clearly Elizabeth's show was never threatened in the least by IDOJ.

(I wish IDOJ's network had been like that! If they had kept renewing IDOJ, I can't see Barbara quitting!)

Elizabeth was apparently against IDOJ and specifically Barbara (her [Elizabeth's] obvious counterpart in IDOJ) because she felt that IDOJ was a 'cheap rip-off' of her show [Bewitched]. I think that's part of the reason why so many Bewitched fans even this day still defame IDOJ by calling it a Bewitched rip-off or wannabe. It's really unfortunate that Elizabeth never bothered to dig beneath the surface similarities to find out how different the two shows really were.

Yeah, exactly. Elizabeth probably thought... another blonde girl with powers is going to be on TV? Then it is a ripoff of my character! I really can't know exactly how she felt, but that's the way I see it.

[Subspace]

jeannietonyfan said:

Yeah, exactly. Elizabeth probably thought... another blonde girl with powers is going to be on TV? Then it is a ripoff of my character! I really can't know exactly how she felt, but that's the way I see it.

Yeap, from the way it's been recorded, that's exactly what Elizabeth thought. Another blonde girl, with powers, with a guy she loves. Ripoff!

[rythmicjea]

This subject has been discussed so many times. The only other thing that I can think of to say to negate the argument that Jeannie has a low intelligence, is that if you have ever had to teach a grandparent how to use the computer you'll understand. To us, we still can't see what is so hard about "click and print" or the shortcut "ctrl+P" but to them there are too many options and they are used to "straight forward" and "only one way is the right way". What we're doing right now (talking on a message board) is too much for them to comprehend. That is the way Jeannie was brought up. If we think that the 1960's were simple can you imagine 2000 years prior?